Pirates of The Caribbean Mary Sues ([info]piratesues) wrote,
@ 2003-08-02 14:23:00
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I apologize for the lack of Sue yesterday - I just never ended up getting around to updating, for various reasons. >_<; If I have time, today, I'll post two. ^^ On an unrelated note, I've made an Anti-X-men Evolution community, because ... yeah. >_o Anyway, on with the fic.

TITLE: The Sands of the Hourglass
AUTHOR: Sing

NAME(S): Jessica Sullivan
AFFILIATION: British nobility
HAIR COLOR: not mentioned
EYE COLOR: not mentioned
SPECIAL POSESSIONS: an hourglass pendant, that I assume will be usefull at some point later in the story.

HISTORY: Lives on an island in the Caribbean with her step-father, who arranges her to be married to a man she hates. He dies in her prescense, and ...

CONNECTIONS TO CHARACTERS: ... is thrown in jail - in the same cell as Jack. What a coincidence.

NOTES: This story has got to have the worst formatting and structure I have ever seen. I don't know if the author used a weird program to write it, or if she's OCD with the return key, but there's like three or four lines in between each "complete thought". It's written in a first-person perspective, but seems to be trying to immitate the person's thought process, so it's hard to tell what the heck is going on at any given time.

SAMPLE OF THE STORY:



How do you become a well-known Lieutenant? Kill all your superiors and don't promote yourself?

Hemmingway…the most boring but well-known Lieutenant in the Caribbean, who seemed to be an extreme anti-pirate ‘kill them all’ person for whatever the reason.

Maybe because that's his job? The British Navy was sent out there for the purpose of protecting colonies from the threat of pirates. There was a definate "kill or be killed" mentality among naval officers during that time.



Of course I secretly agreed with disgust the subject about those seafaring scum.

But your character is going to hook up with Jack anyway, so what's the point?

But I despised Hemmingway. And whatever Hemmingway did not like. I liked. So in front of him, I spoke highly about the courage and boldness of pirates, satisfied with a small wince or a cough from the man.



Short and pudgy, the familiar white haired wig on his obviously baldhead, the small goatee, small eyes, and those always-grinning fat lips. Always about money and some boring lecture about his dead wife. From the way he spoke of his dead wife, it may seem that he had been the one to murder her. I was almost sure.


I really think this person has no grasp whatsoever on Navy ranks. Men that old were either retired, or Admirals (or Commodores, depending on the situation). Lieutenant is a mid-way rank that most people got to during the end of their required service time. Generally, only people who wanted to make a career out of being in the Navy stayed on after that.



I shook my head



To fill my head with that dreadful man was far a wasteful thing to do.



Breathing out a small sigh, I stretched and froze to hear pounding footsteps stomping closer and closer to my door.



Expecting a knock on the door. I quickly stood waiting.



Without a warning the door swung open as widely as it could, presenting a tall lean figure casually leaning by the door’s frame.



My eyes narrowed.



Of course….who else?



“Richard- when will you learn to be a gentleman and knock before entering a lady’s room?” I exasperatedly spoke



Why was he smiling so widely?



My cheeks flushed angrily, amused was he?


Well, he might be, but the readers definately are not.





The fatefull ... uh, arrest.

Jack pretended to snore as a prison guard walked up to his cell, unlocking the gates.



Nimbly, he stood up, watching eagerly at the opening cell.



“Ah no you don’t” the guard spat, “You stay put, I have extra guards who aren’t afraid to shoot”



“Then why open the gates?” Jack asked slowly, jerkily looking at the open door- his freedom…



A sudden figure was pushed and had fallen next to him with a small thump.



“Have fun with you’re new cellmate” the guard snickered as he locked the gate again and whistled back upstairs.



“Well now, that’s interesting” Jack stared at the stairs where the guards had walked off.



Turning to his new prison friend, he squinted through the candlelight.



“Ye all right lad?”



A soft gasp came from the figure.



Jack’s eyes widened.



Well now, that’s interesting….


First of all, no lady would EVER be accused of murder unless she was caught in the act and there was irrefutable evidence. No one at that time thouhgt proper ladies were even capable of something like that. Even if they WERE accused, they would not be arrested. They would most likely be kept at home under close watch until a trial of some kind could be thrown together. The idea of such a high class woman being thrown in jail is rediculous.

Another thing - WHY can people not come up with ORIGINAL DIALOUGE for Jack? Is it THAT HARD? Sheesh.



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(Anonymous)
2003-08-02 09:55 pm UTC (link)
>First of all, no lady would EVER be accused of murder unless she was caught in the act and there was irrefutable evidence. No one at that time thought proper ladies were even capable of something like that.<


being a woman is one of the reasons lizzie borton wasn't convicted. and that was, what, a hundred years after PotC is set?

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[info]maikaerin
2003-08-03 07:49 am UTC (link)
Sings a song: "Lizze Borton took an axe, gave her mother 40 whacks. When she saw what she had done, she gave her father 41."

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::snickers::
[info]cheesedanish
2003-08-03 10:37 pm UTC (link)
Actually, I think it's Lizzie Borden...but nonetheless I love that little quote there. Quite amusing. :D

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[info]hazmatlatte
2003-08-02 10:09 pm UTC (link)
...Women also wouldn't be thrown into the same jail cell as a man. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. End.

(Reply to this)

*tries to comfort piratesues*
[info]ghanihwi
2003-08-02 11:06 pm UTC (link)
Another thing - WHY can people not come up with ORIGINAL DIALOUGE for Jack? Is it THAT HARD? Sheesh.

Just stop hurting yourself over it. I've come to a happy place in my mind where I can just accept that these witless fangirls don't have an original thought in thier heads. Don't think on it too hard- your head will explode long before the fangirls are finished writing.

But I despised Hemmingway. And whatever Hemmingway did not like. I liked.

But of course she hated and despised her person-who-is-not-Jack-Sparrow-and-therefore-isn't-my-twu-wuv-*pout*. Isn't it remotely possible that you can be happy in a relationship before it is sent down the crapper? Sheesh.

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[info]the_grim_wombat
2003-08-03 01:55 am UTC (link)
What I'm not getting is why the fangirls hate the well-mannered British Royal Navy officers, and instead go for the dirty unwashed rapists. It boggles the mind.

They make it sound like Norrington and any other officer was an evil man because they don't like pirates... But what I'm confused about is why any 17th century girl in their right mind would like pirates anyway. Honestly, did they not see the scene at the beginning of the movie? Burning the town, raping women, looting, pillaging, and other such piratey pastimes. Don't get me wrong, I love pirates and have since I was but a wee lass, but if I'd been alive back in the 1600s/1700s, I'm sure I'd have been a lot less thrilled with the idea. That's really the more typical image of pirates... Take a look at Barbossa's ship and count how many of those pirates are sexy. I count... Uh... Zero.

And even Jack, the NICE pirate, has his problems. Sparrow's a hottie, for sure... But when do you think was the last time he bathed? ........Eeeew.

Given the choice, I'd take Norrington over Jack any day. If nothing else, at least he's CLEAN. And has never pillaged. Or raped. Or burned anyone's house to the ground. Sounds like much better husband material. (And he's sweet, really! Why do they all hate the poor Commodore? But that's another rant for another day.)

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(Anonymous)
2003-08-03 02:23 am UTC (link)
i think the appeal of a pirate is that they get to CHOOSE him, where as most naval marriages, they don't get a choice. but, alot of these sue's have horrible parents, if they haven't been raised to, you know, honor their family! isn't that one of the fundamentals children are taught to do, obey they father and so forth. everyone wants to be desdemona.

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[info]piratesues
2003-08-03 02:52 am UTC (link)
This sounds awfully pro-Sue...

I think the appeal of pirates comes from Johnny Depp. If they'd cast someone who fit in with the rest of Barbossa's crew, there would be no fangirls.

Not every marriage in the 17th century was arranged. Naval marriages? Hardly. Most people did marry for affection and convenience, if not love. Only people who desperately needed to secure ties between families went the way of arranged marriages. Or, in the case of royalty, keep up appearences. ANY woman brought up in a high-class family understood that marriage was just an allignment of sorts. Both men and woman in that day cheated on their spouses and kept consorts and all kinds of crap like that. This whole "Boo hoo, daddy's making me marry someone I don't like" thing is utter BS. Girls would enjoy it, deal with it, or flat-out refuse. If they were legal adults there would probably not be much of an issue - like all these Sues are.

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(Anonymous)
2003-08-03 03:51 am UTC (link)
i'm not pro-sue or anything, i'm just one of those people who likes to point out possible good qualities. and i agree with you completely. if these characters were at all realistic they'd go for the officer instead of the pirate, love or not. i'm just saying (and evidently put it badly) that women rarely got to chose their own husbands, let alone love them. marriage really didn't mean anything but a tie between families. some fangirls out there can't handle that and believe marriage is set solely on love, and for any reason other than love is horrible, and hence so if the groom to be. these writers are thinking too much like modern girls then 17th century girls.

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[info]aubby
2003-08-03 03:09 am UTC (link)
On a totally unrelated note, pirates were generally actually not allowed to rape!

I'm not defending the person who wrote this story, mind you. Just useless trivia.

But it's true. Who would want to marry an unwashed brute who is wanted by about every British naval fleet imaginable? Any self-respecting lady would rather bite off her tongue and die.

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[info]collie_wing
2003-08-03 03:52 am UTC (link)
Any self-respecting lady would rather bite off her tongue and die.

*does so after reading the whole fic*

I dunno, pirates tend to be romanticized alot. Granted, you hear stories of some displaying morals in instences(one pirate absolutely REFUSED to be called that) but they were generally not good. Even today there are still pirates, but they now use motor boats and they're like, the gang bangers of the sea. Outlaws can be nice. Frank and Jesse James once helped an old woman who was going to lose her house pay the bank. How sweet. Of course, they held up the wagon carrying the strongbox and stole the strongbox (not sure if they shot anyone, probably) to do it, but it's the THOUGHT that counts. Wait....that's cowboys. Well, whatever.

The point is, proper ladies would probably be told their entire lives about what bad eggs (heeh) pirates were. And they were, for the most part. Norrington and the British navy are trying to protect people from criminals. It's like falling in love with someone robbing your house and holding you up at gunpoint.

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[info]the_grim_wombat
2003-08-03 04:04 am UTC (link)
Norrington and the British navy are trying to protect people from criminals.

EXACTLY! I saw this one girl whining about how meeeen Norrington was because he hated pirates, was going to hang Jack... IT'S HIS FRICKIN' JOB. And he does it quite well.

It's like falling in love with someone robbing your house and holding you up at gunpoint.

Oh God... I can just see someone using that as a plot device... *cringe* It's more possible that one might think.

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[info]collie_wing
2003-08-03 05:45 am UTC (link)
and perhaps it's because he recognizes the threats pirates pose. It's like hating the police when they're catching and bringing criminals to justice. "They're so meeeean they caught that guy who did the homicides! HOW NOT FAIR! He's a hottie!"

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[info]the_grim_wombat
2003-08-03 06:50 am UTC (link)
That's EXACTLY what I've been saying.

Your icon's hilariously funny, btw. And adorable.

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[info]collie_wing
2003-08-03 07:22 am UTC (link)
Thanks! Yours is groove-a-licious :D

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[info]piratesues
2003-08-03 05:30 am UTC (link)
Pirates were definately NOT romanticized at the time, though, especially not in island colonies. Pirates were hated and feared because they would attack supply ships and kill people. It's highly unlikely anyone would day-dream about running away with the guys who were constantly stealing the stuff you needed to survive and killing your friends.

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[info]kapunua
2003-08-03 04:06 am UTC (link)
On a totally unrelated note, pirates were generally actually not allowed to rape!

This is so. There really was a code, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I read recently that, among pirates, rape ("distressal of a lady" or something like that, they called it,) was punishable by death.

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[info]the_grim_wombat
2003-08-03 05:02 am UTC (link)
Hmm. That's funkee. Cuz, like, I always thought the pillaging and the raping went hand-in-hand, so to speak. I guess it's just a misconception.

Nifty.

Still, though... The smell, and the larceny, and the murderousness... Yeah, it would get on my nerves.

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[info]wal_lace
2003-08-03 09:39 pm UTC (link)
Yes, there was a Pirate's Code. You know who made sure they followed it? Nobody.

Pirates had no formal organisation. Their only justice was a hempen rope, their only authority was the Captain. Many pirates would have followed the code. Many more would not have.

When Morgan's men took Panama they destroyed the city in an orgy of pillage, murder and rape.

Some pirates wouldn't have harmed women and children. Others would have flayed them alive. The world is not a simple place.

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[info]kapunua
2003-08-03 10:50 pm UTC (link)
I rather thought that went without saying. There are rules, codes, mores and such in pretty much every group, affiliation etc. and there are always those who follow it and those who don't. Many things are against "law" or "code" and many people do them anyway.

My point wasn't to say "no pirates or groups of pirates ever raped anyone," but rather to point out that it was frowned upon.

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[info]piratesues
2003-08-03 10:55 pm UTC (link)
It wasn't actually frowned apon. The code was more of a "see, we're TRYING to be nice people, really. Please don't hang us" sort of thing. One of the pirates who supposedly started the code, Morgan, was notorious for the brutal way he would allow his crew to act - they were free to murder and rape all they wanted. (At least, I think so. My history of that time is really sketchy. Feel free to correct me.)

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[info]southernwinds
2003-08-15 09:57 pm UTC (link)
I'm not doubting you, so don't get me wrong, but I'm just interested... I mean, I find some articles, but they're rarely anything other than instances where women were pirates. Oy, fangirls... anyways, just wondering where you read that? I'd like to read it!
Heh. Pirates have been romanticized; outlaws of any kind have. Jesse James, Billy the Kid, even Hardin, who shot a man for snoring. But now they're heroes.
People don't realize what *real* pirates were like, they just know, "Ooh! Jack Sparrow's a pirate!"
The only thing that really bugged me was in the end where Elizabeth says, "No, he's a pirate!"
Yeah. That's really gonna help the Governor's view of him... *Rollz eyez*

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[info]kapunua
2003-08-03 03:48 am UTC (link)
Man, I was just going to add this fic. Sorry for jumping right in on you guys here. I'm enough of a fangirl that I've already written my share of POTC fic, but I swear to god, no Mary Sues. ;)

I just reviewed her on GAFF a minute ago, actually. In part, this is what i thought:

"This fic has the obligatory "Mary Sue must marry a stuffy uppity nobleman! Oh howl, howl, howl!!" angle, which I'm sure we've never encountered before. A few cutesy (not cute, mind you) anacrhonisms, a few ugly misspellings, bad punctuation, authors notes in the middle of the story ("He smiled haughtily at the sight of how the breeches clung to his ripped thighs and enhanced his best features, his calves (I know what you were thinking you dirty reader, you!)." Doesn't bother to keep her facts straight, and her advice to people who don't like that? "; Bite my ass, use your imagination, go to therapy, take up a hobby, get a pet, get a life, f*ck off, or you can tell me a real port there and I’ll consider revising it." Ahh, now that's the kind of attitude that keeps writers growing.

And what were we just discussing about how Mary Sue is hot for Jack Sparrow cause Johnny Depp is under there, and he must clean up real nice? Well this chick has a chapter dedicated to that. In fact, the chapter itself is called "You Clean Up Real Perdy!"
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Man, I was <i>just</i> going to add this fic. Sorry for jumping right in on you guys here. I'm enough of a fangirl that I've already written my share of POTC fic, but I swear to god, no Mary Sues. ;)

I just reviewed her on <a href="http://www.voy.com/13774/"> GAFF</a> a minute ago, actually. In part, this is what i thought:

<i>"This fic has the obligatory "Mary Sue must marry a stuffy uppity nobleman! Oh howl, howl, howl!!" angle, which I'm sure we've never encountered before. A few cutesy (not cute, mind you) anacrhonisms, a few ugly misspellings, bad punctuation, authors notes in the middle of the story ("He smiled haughtily at the sight of how the breeches clung to his ripped thighs and enhanced his best features, his calves (I know what you were thinking you dirty reader, you!)." Doesn't bother to keep her facts straight, and her advice to people who don't like that? "; Bite my ass, use your imagination, go to therapy, take up a hobby, get a pet, get a life, f*ck off, or you can tell me a real port there and I’ll consider revising it." Ahh, now that's the kind of attitude that keeps writers growing.

And what were we just discussing about how Mary Sue is hot for Jack Sparrow cause Johnny Depp is under there, and he must clean up real nice? Well this chick has a chapter dedicated to that. In fact, the chapter itself is called "You Clean Up Real Perdy!" <_< Ugh.

But best of all, look at her main ff.net page. I'm so glad to know that she enjoys farting and peeing. Isn't that just what you needed to know?"</i>

Mostly because of her "I don't care" attitude (and partly because of my own hormones at the moment ;D ) this Sue sort of pissed me off really quickly. *cough*

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[info]kapunua
2003-08-03 02:19 pm UTC (link)
Tch! I am stupid, ignore me. I got this story here mixed up with this one, "Journey to the Past", which is an altogether different (and much worse) PirateSue.

My bad, sorry!

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[info]laragoth
2003-08-03 03:50 am UTC (link)
Jack, buried in a bottle of rum in a corner, has asked me to inform you all that as many times as he says "That's interesting" just in this segment alone is enough for all of us to take up a round.

I told him that we may have to come up with the POTC Sue Drinking Game at this rate. He says if rum's involved he's in.

"Take two drinks if they are wearing a significant piece of jewelery 'round their scraggly lil' necks!"

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[info]phantasmrose
2003-08-03 03:54 am UTC (link)
Take another if there's any Norrington-bashing! (which there is in this fic, but the Commodore's still recovering from that Will-rape issue, and I decided not to highlight that...)

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[info]collie_wing
2003-08-03 03:54 am UTC (link)
Take four if the jewelry makes them do something because of a destiny and/or calling.

Take six if it's a return of the Aztec gold. Hell, I'll take six anyway.

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[info]the_grim_wombat
2003-08-03 03:59 am UTC (link)
Whoo! PotC Sue drinking game? That'd be great... One drink if they're engaged against their will to a snooty uppity nobleman!

I like your icon, by the way. Norrington doesn't get enough love. Not that I'm in any way encouraging Sues, but odds are they wouldn't want him anyway. I think it's the normal-ness. Or the fact that he bathes. Or some other silly unnattractive feature like that.

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[info]laragoth
2003-08-03 04:19 am UTC (link)
Heh, thank you :) Jack's a blast, but Norrington...

I've warmed up to the guy.

*looks around* Uhoh. Have I just started up a new memory or something?

"Finish your drink if I propose to th' strumpet. And then, drink another bottle of rum besides."

Um, Jack? Your alcohol tolerance and mine are two different things entirely.

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[info]piratesues
2003-08-03 05:05 am UTC (link)
Norrington needs more love from fans, and not from Sues. *lol* He's my favorite character, tied with Jack (of course).

I've actually got my eye on the one existing Norrington Sue for tomorrow's post (I'm not gonna have time/energy to do another tonight).

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[info]collie_wing
2003-08-03 05:25 am UTC (link)
Norrington love is like Mr. Darcy love from Pride and Predjudice. He seems all stuffy and full of himself (and he can be at many times, to say) but he's overall an awesome guy when it boils down to it.

Take five drinks if Jack utters the words "my love" in a "tender voice" and not his usual "luv" manor. Take another if it follows with a pledge of devotion of some sort.

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[info]skjam
2003-08-03 01:57 pm UTC (link)
From Elizabeth's point of view, Norrington has two major character flaws. First, he doesn't pay attention to how she actually feels. (At the beginning of the "now" story, it's painfully evident that Norrington completely fails to notice that Elizabeth just isn't interested in marrying him. So much so, that she falls off the parapet before he figures out what's going on.)

Second, Norrington considers his duty as an officer sworn to wipe out piracy more important than human feelings. So even though Jack just saved a life, a life important to Norrington, the commodore still has Jack put in gaol to await execution. It's the "proper" thing to do. And this sort of incident happens two or three more times.

Since Elizabeth is really a late-20th Century woman, who believes that her opinions matter, and has rather a romantic view of pirates (sheltered upbringing, anyone?) these attitudes on Norrington's part make him a bad match for her.

By the end of the movie, however, Norrington has softened just a little bit. He's genuinely glad that he doesn't have to hang Jack...this time. And I believe that Norrington is actually relieved to hand Elizabeth over to Will, now that he understands how annoying she'd be to him.

Eventually, Norrington will find a woman who's willing to be a proper English wife to him, though finding an eligible lady of sufficient breeding may be difficult in Port Royale.


SKJAM!

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Drinking Game
[info]arielchan
2003-08-04 02:59 am UTC (link)
Oh this could be fun... Four drinks if Jack promises to give up Piracy for Miss Sue! ^_^

~*Ariel*~

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[info]kasatka
2003-08-03 05:58 am UTC (link)
Commodore isn't even a rank - it's a temporary post. =)

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[info]piratesues
2003-08-03 06:09 am UTC (link)
I'm fairly sure it was still a big deal to be promoted that far (you'd have to have been a captain to be granted the position of commodore, methinks). It wasn't a "you didn't quite make it to Admiral" consolation prize, it was an "oh crap we need someone in charge because there's crazy shit going down and you haven't quite filled all the requirements to be admiral/there's no one here who can promote you that far" kind of deal.

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[info]the_grim_wombat
2003-08-03 06:54 am UTC (link)
I was talking to my dad, who's ex-Navy, and he mentioned that Commodores only exist during wartime. Otherwise, they're referred to as Rear Admiral, Lower Half. So as I understand, it's basically the position of Admiral, only... less so. Not sure whether it worked the same back then, or in the British Navy, though.

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[info]lasergirl
2003-08-03 05:40 pm UTC (link)
*SNERK*

I'll take the Lower Half of Rear Admiral Norrington for two Doubloons and a bottle of spiced rum.

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[info]laragoth
2003-08-03 08:57 pm UTC (link)
*doubles over giggling*

I'll up you two more doubloons and...and..um...another two!

And maybe another bottle of rum.

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[info]lasergirl
2003-08-03 09:29 pm UTC (link)
hell, two bottles of rum would get him drunk, and i'm sure four doubloons is more than enough to pay for the room and food.... i'll share him with you!!!!!

go go go go go!!!

** almost wishing i was on a potc shipping list, and yet... awfully glad i'm not **

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[info]laragoth
2003-08-03 09:38 pm UTC (link)
*eyebrow-wraggle*

Tempting. VERY tempting. *smirk*

"You're gonna need more rum than THAT to loosen the good Commodore's stiff shirt."

You HAD to make your commentary, didn't you Jack?

*Jack merely smiles and makes his trademark bow*

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[info]lasergirl
2003-08-04 01:30 am UTC (link)
**mmmm i love your icon!**

i vote me in as a Sue. I am Mary-Beth Claire Starr and I have red hair down to my...... AHEM. Yes, and I get Norrington drunk and we marry and live happily ever after.

And I don't tell him that a) I'm a pirate until after we're married, and b) I'm Jack's long-lost sister or cousin.

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[info]wal_lace
2003-08-03 09:36 pm UTC (link)
An essay on Royal Navy rank structure.

Basically, a Commodore is a temporary rank available to the senior post-captain present. Seniority in the Navy at the time was determined very strictly on date of commission. Since a Captain in the Royal Navy is equivalent to the land rank of full colonel, and Jack Davenport is just thirty years old, there's either a serious shortage of Royal Navy captains in the Caribbean, or Norrington is a quite astonishingly competent officer.
(Unlike the British Army in this period, there was no purchasing of commissions in the Royal Navy. Promotion was gained solely on merit)

You don't get to be a thirty-year-old Commodore by anything less than dedication to your job. So it's no surprise he's not the most touchy-feely of characters.

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[info]piratesues
2003-08-03 11:00 pm UTC (link)
Exactly! Thank you! *lol*

there's either a serious shortage of Royal Navy captains in the Caribbean, or Norrington is a quite astonishingly competent officer.

I think it's both. Most of the high ranking officers did not want to go to the Caribbean because it was seen as an uncivilised, wild place, and they all would rather stay in Europe or the Americas. But, Port Royal was a huge settlement, and undoubtably had a larger naval presence than most, so we can't assume Norrington is supposed to be the only captain there. We know for sure there WAS at least one other - the captain who came over at the begining of the film (once the shipwreck is discovered, Norrington orders someone to wake the captain). So either he's around as a higher ranking officer, or he's retired and left Norrington to deal with everyone on his own.

Or, I could just be rambling incoherently. Whee!

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